Enraged Feminist vs Utah’s Sexy Dancers
March 22nd, 2008
“Dear Eric,
I’ve noticed that there are lots of scantily-clad young girls on your photo stream. Aren’t you afraid that you are going to offend 90% of your clients in Mormonville, USA and don’t you think that by giving these harlots a public place to flaunt themselves you’re perpetuating the stereotype that girls are merely sexy playthings?”
You should take those photos down or you’ll never find any work in this state!!!
– Enraged Feminist [Yes, this is actually how she signed!]
Whoah, Enraged. Calm down. First of all, those who would be so offended that they wouldn’t hire me are not the sort of people I want to work for anyway. Call it client darwinism. It’s a good thing. Trust me — I’m not hurting for business. In fact, I’m hiring interns to keep up with the workload. From a photographer’s business perspective, being true to my unique vision is my primary marketing strategy. My style and subjects are my brand, and what do you know — sex sells. The last thing I’m going to do is shoot some conservative idea of what people want to buy. I prefer to shoot what I love.
Anyway, these girls aren’t the primary subjects of my photographs. I mostly sell photos of the DJ’s and other performers. That’s where my real passion lies, and that’s where the real money is. They need photos for their presskits and promotions, and they’re willing to pay for them. Since most of them are from out of state, and unlikely to be conservative, my choice to include these girls in my photo sets has no negative impact on my bottom line.
Another interesting point is that photos of beautiful girls are far and away the most popular photos in my photo stream, and it’s a safe bet that many of my fans found me initially through one of those popular images.
As for your second argument, I’ve just had a discussion very much like this on the UtahRaves.com message board. Here’s a snippet of that conversation:
“And being the feminist that I am I think that they’re just ridiculous and perpetuate the image that women are sex toys here for the pleasure of certian perverts and macho sexist idiots.” – triciaprefect
“People said the same thing about Madonna.” – me
“Madonna was (is) unique.” – adrena_line
“So is Ms Easy. The point is that being sexy doesn’t always ‘perpetuate the image that women are sex toys,’ and some particularly strong women manage to be true to themselves and flaunt their sexuality in a way that is empowering and liberating to women.” – me
In another conversation, somebody accused me of being exploitive of these girls — using them to sell my photos and services as if it’s wrong to make money from anything that could be considered prurient. Far from feeling exploited, many of these girls are friends, and they respond enthusiastically when they see me. They plaster my photos all over their MySpace pages. They proudly display them to their friends, and many of them have asked me at one time or another for more formal photo shoots. These girls trust me because they know if there’s a photo they don’t want posted, I’ll take it down. None of them have ever complained to me about the way that I conduct myself. I think it’s telling that the people accusing me of exploitation are not the people being “exploited”.
We can argue until the cows come home about whether it’s wrong or right to post pictures of hot girls in skimpy clothing on the internet, but like any honest straight man, I like a dose of sexy in my photos now and then. Call me a sexist pig if you like, but consider this:
I celebrate the individuality and self expression of everybody I encounter in the nightlife scene, whereas, you assume that these girls are harlots, tear them down, and take the time out of your day to rant to me about it, just for trying to express themselves in a way you don’t like. You profess to be a feminist, but isn’t feminism about freedom and rights? These girls want the freedom and right to express their sexuality in an appropriate venue. Why should I deny them that, and refuse to take and post their photographs? They are part of the nightlife, and my job is to celebrate the nightlife, and all that it includes.
Since you asked me so politely to address this issue, here they are in all their bare-skinned glory: Utah’s sexy nightlife dancers.
What are your thoughts on this debate? Take a look at some of the girls in question, and then click the little comments button to chime in.
As a proud feminist, I do not feel offended whatsoever by your photos of scantily clad women at clubs, but more frankly, BORED. It seems that practically male photographers portfolio consists of the same rap video wannabe, highly glossy, plastic surgery addicted girls. There are SO MANY other ways to be sexy and artfully convey the nude body. Why does playboy have to be the authority on what is sexy? And why do photographers want to take pictures of the same stuff that everyone else is taking pictures of?
I live in LA, though, so I see this crap everywhere. Maybe its edgy in mormon Utah.
I think this can all be summed up in two words: Mormon and Feminist.
Now lets get back to our regularly scheduled program…
Like India I too am a feminist and I am a Christian. There were Pharisees back in the day to police behavior and Jesus would piss them off because he was eating with tax collectors and prostitutes. Jesus told his critics to chill that they weren’t here to judge others. Judgement came later – completely out of our immediate power.
I’m a man and I appreciate women….that said your critic might find joy if she spent less time judging.
check out (what I believe to be) feminist erotic photography:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tetheredto/
portraying women (and men!) as people, not Barbie dolls.
Sour grapes my friend
If they can not have it, you shouldn’t
don’t try to figure out fanatics (of any kind)
there is not point
and don’t try to fall to their level, even if you just want to understand them
The solution is simple
ignore them
keep doing good work
if somebody threatens you let the police know
perhaps through a lawyer
after all they don’t have to watch your photos, do they?
I want it in poster size!
Really people need to get a life!
Nice images =)
I found who is bothering you
flickr.com/photos/timzim/113252300/
beware
Beauty and sexy mean different things to different people. Viva la difference! Of course, I shoot landscapes, dogs, and kittens so what do I know?
Stefanos, that’s a riot!
Definitely, lauriemarie. For example, I find some of tethered to the sun’s work interesting, but not beautiful or sexy/erotic in any way, personally.
To Eric – The more i get to know the man that you are, the more I like you. I am grateful that you and your art are companions on my journey and look forward to meeting you face to face someday. May your skills and your integrity continue to grow and may you see the light in even more ways to capture it.
To the wounded parents – Your children are not acting out because of what Eric has done. Nor, as others here suggest, is it because of what you have done. I don’t have any simple answers, I just know that i need to keep loving my daughter and stay true to not accept “unacceptable” behavior. May you and your children let go and live happily, joyously and freely as soon as possible.
To those others here engaged in righteous causes, may you have eloquence in stating what it is the you believe in and for where your passion and heart lies, and remember how much we all resist and resent others who try to tell us what we must be thinking or believing. May we all share what you have instead of attacking what others may have.
To the ladies, may you always have the freedom to pursue that which you see as good and right without others seeing it in any other way.
To all here, may we all remember that there is no one way to “Be”. As for myself, i am grateful that there is also no one way we must all “See”, either.
And lastly, may I someday see light like Eric does….
Eric Hamilton: Please go on doing what you want to do and ignore the remarks made by some people. You know if your photograph is good – don’t even think about what they say.
If I don’t understand a picture I don’t comment on it, because I can’t. That doesn’t mean it is bad – it means that I can’t understand it.
Please go on doing what you do so well- You do, that voodoo, that you do so well (I can’t remember the name of the song now).
Philip
self esteem = SELF esteem…..not…..
eric hamilton took pictures of beautiful women and now I feel fat and ugly… esteem…..so it’s everyone but my own SELFs fault.
She’s a loser.
I agree with Kelly Cardona.
And as a woman of larger size, I can tell you that sure, sometimes it bothers me to see scantily-clad skinny women in pictures, knowing that what I see in the pictures is considered to be the “beautiful” norm, like those women are what men think of when they think of women.
But in the same token, I also know that women are sexy creatures by nature. We were designed with sexy-ness, and not just on the physical level. We are each alluring and appealing in our own way, and that includes with our bodies.
(How was that for feminism?)
The problem lies in the fact that sexuality has taken over the greater American culture. Look in magazines and you find sexy ads for nearly any product, as though buying that product would make you instantly more appealing. They show sexy scenarios, instead of people who are happy. And any time you turn on the television you are going to be bombarded with sexual innuendos or situations, and this is what I believe Feminist was mad about. (She just parades around expressing her discontent with anyone she thinks she can get across to, since the media big wigs are out of her reach.)
Sex is a part of our culture, our humanity, our nature, and our survival. Trying to stamp it out is just…..ridiculous.
(Though, to cover my own six, I understand the desire to limit what children see. And I understand it on a religious level, as well, because I used to attend a Pentecostal church, and much of the doctrine has stayed in my head.)
Your photo shows nothing distasteful. I see four beautiful women posing for a pic. Big deal. They aren’t being abused, they aren’t showing nudity, they aren’t even posing suggestively. The photo exudes the confidence of the women, not their sexuality.
Being sexy and being sexual are related but different things.
All I see in Enraged Feminist’s comment above is someone trying to use the power of her own personal political correctness and her own religious views to try and influence what other people do.
If people (like her) would just go on living their own lives, doing what they do, they can limit what they see and what their children see without making anyone feel encroached upon. (How many wars, revolutions, and countries have been started by people trying to influence their religious views on other people?)
Honestly, if I were as outwardly attractive and confident as those women in the photo, I’d love to be photographed.
((NOT just for my own ego-boost, either.))
Keep up the good work.
Being a guy (I know, I’m sorry girls, what can I say? It wasn’t my fault, I didn’t choose it!!! lol) I think the media concept of ‘beautiful’ women is distorted anyway, irrespective of the fact ‘real women’ don’t look like that. Personally I prefer women to have curves, there’s nothing sexier (to me at least) than,,,,,,,,,, well,,,,,,, ‘Child-bearing’ hips shall we say = ). Beauty, as the saying goes, is in the eye of the beholder and no woman should ever feel cheated/insulted/inferior by such images.
As men we have become fine-tuned by the media to some extent to think thin = sexy and it, I suppose it must influence our opinion to some extent but in total honesty it tends to be a reflex reaction to go “Wow” when one of these type of women are seen but in utmost honesty I’d much sooner see a well curved bottom and hips sooooo much sexier. Most women probably fall into the class of pear-shaped. Well, to me pair-shaped = perfect-shaped. Everyone is obviously entitled to their opinion as to what is sexy but for the biggest majority of men it isn’t standard model material. So girls, don’t EVER think you’re not sexy. There’s enough so-called BBW, plumper, mature etc sites out there, the so-called ‘readers-wives’ and if we all just fancied stick-insects these sites wouldn’t exist. So if your partner thinks you’re not sexy, it isn’t that you’re not sexy, it’s they’re the wrong partner, go and get a new one that does think it! trust me, someone WILL think you’re sexy.
Like I said, I’m a guy (and such probably a pervert lol) so yes, I look at,,,,,,, errrr, rude images (hey!!! I’m only a guy remember!!!) The number of times I’ve seen images of some lass modeling for her partner and trying to cover what they consider their flaws is infuriating. Firstly, if she’s that unsure of herself, she really shouldn’t have been put in that position (and THAT is nearer an abuse of sexuality, not someone happy to do it, paid or otherwise) and secondly (and much more important) if the shoot has been done well (or at least every effort made by the photographer to try their best in my case lol) then any naked human form should protray a thing of beauty.
To be frank (and this effects us guys just as much you know!!!) ‘sexy’ should really be read as ‘confident’. A confident person will always potray ‘sexiness’ A lass in sexy lingerie (male perspective again) will always look silly if she’s hunched-over, trying to hide her so-called imperfections etc etc. Whack those clothes on a jump out at your guy head-held high oozing confidence and I’ll wager a weeks salary his eyes light up!!! Don’t ever fall into the trap that because your other half looks at other women he obviously doesn’t find you attractive anymore, it’s sod all to do with it, to look is just our flawed genetic make-up I’m afraid and as the wife says “I don’t care were you get your appitite providing you only eat at home” , is good advice.
I’m with dtbrandwood on this point:
Confidence is sexy. You don’t have to be a stick figure to have that!
Eric,
You’re not wrong with what you do. Anyone can snap a picture. You are a photographer.
As a photographer, I am a bit biased towards the work itself and not the subject. As married man, yes, the people you photograph are attractive, but I’m not leaving my wife/cheating/oogling the girls you photograph. And my wife is confident enough, trusting, and intelligent enough to know that as a guy, I will look. But I’ll be at home, in bed with her at the end of the day.
As far as any parents who’re concerned with their kids’ actions, the “you’re photographing it, you’re responsible” reasoning doesn’t fly. He’s not putting on the event. He’s not inviting the people. He’s not handing them drugs/alcohol/porn/water/vegetables/elephants. He’s not doing anything but holding a camera and recording his surroundings.
Oh, Eric, I hope you never happen to be on the scene of an accident with your camera. If you take pictures and post them, you’ll be encouraging more people to have accidents. And please, don’t take pictures of people eating. Someone’s daughter might want to have a cheeseburger. The horror!
As anyone with a lick of sense in their minds can see, Eric isn’t in control of the surroundings he photographs. He just photographs it as it happens. That’s what he’s paid to do. And he does it well.
Maybe I’m a bit jaded because I’m a photographer and I see the world through the lens too. Or maybe it’s because I live life the way I do without following anyone’s path but my own. I just can’t hate on Eric for what he does. Then again, I’m intelligent enough to realize that there is so much more in this world than what some people are led to believe, and that doesn’t make it wrong or them right.
(I’m really trying to not hate on religion/religious nuts/uninformed persons/the ignorant.)
Wow Eric,
Where to start…
I took the time to read through every comment on this post. I have seen you working at a few parties that I have attended and have actually been completely overwhelmed by your professionalism with both the dancers, and the dj’s. You have turned what started as a side project into something that you truly enjoy, and you have made every one of your pictures personal, whether it’s seeing the dancers/dj’s on a personal level, or just seeing the way that you look at the club/rave scene as a whole. You have thrown more into photography than most people have ever done, and I applaud you for that. The time that you take to work with people is amazing, and it absolutely disgusts me that women that consider themselves feminists are actually taking the initiative to call you a pervert, or say you are filth.
I would love to know what Enraged Feminist thinks of porn, if this is filth.
Please don’t take the comments so heavily. I know it is hard because it is both something you love to do, and a profession that you are being criticized on, but these words are only there to hurt you, most of it won’t mean a thing to people.
The death threats are ridiculous though.. someone actually threatening to kill you over taking a picture of someone who is obviously posing FOR YOU. These women are proud of you, your work, and themselves, and it all shines through in the pictures you take.
I know that the girls are comfortable with the photography. If they weren’t they wouldn’t be shooting. However, I do know that Eric takes nude photographs, and I have to ask why. What is the reason for nude photos? They aren’t sold, so there goes the “sex sells” argument. So why are these girls being asked to take off their clothes? If the claim is “for artistic purposes,” I would have to truly question that motive. There is a fine line between art and pornography (which can be defined as, according to the American Heritage Dictionary, sexually explicit pictures, writing, or other material whose primary purpose is to cause sexual arousal), and I think some of the near nude (and the nude shoots) really fall into grey territory.
I had an interesting comment today on my controversial blog post, “Enraged Feminist vs Utah’s Sexy Dancers.” Here it is, with my response:
I know that the girls are comfortable with the photography. If they weren’t they wouldn’t be shooting. However, I do know that Eric takes nude photographs, and I have to ask why. What is the reason for nude photos? They aren’t sold, so there goes the “sex sells” argument. So why are these girls being asked to take off their clothes? If the claim is “for artistic purposes,” I would have to truly question that motive. There is a fine line between art and pornography (which can be defined as, according to the American Heritage Dictionary, sexually explicit pictures, writing, or other material whose primary purpose is to cause sexual arousal), and I think some of the near nude (and the nude shoots) really fall into grey territory.
Mr. Anonymous,
I am building collections of intimate portraiture, both nude and implied nude that I hope to compile into high quality books and fine art giclee prints. These collections will be marketed to fine art collectors — NOT to porn sites.
There is a long history of nude art, and many of the world’s most famous and celebrated portrait artists have done nude work. Would you say the same about their collections?
FYI, nobody yet is privy to my full nudes collection. I have never released some of my best nude work, and don’t intend to until I have enough of it to do a high profile gallery showing and publish my first book of nude works.
My nude collection is not simply made up of skinny model types. Also included are full figured women, and many people who do not fit the standard definition of pretty girls according to Cosmo. One of the things I hope to accomplish with the collection is to redefine the concept of “sexy girl” to extend beyond the skin deep beauty concept — to capture the essence of a sexy personality. A woman’s ability to feel sexy empowers her.
My beautiful wife is the driving inspiration for my nudes collection. She is an outstanding, sexy woman who has struggled her whole life with self esteem issues because she doesn’t fit typical “sexy” stereotypes… but she is very sexy to me! I want her, and women like her to understand that they too are worthy of love, devotion, admiration, desire, and even lust. I think that women need to feel lusted after once in a while. Sex and procreation are essential to the continuation of the human race. As a spiritual person, I treat sexuality with sacred respect. Love and lust are powerful forces that speak to the core of our self worth as human beings, and everybody should have the right to enjoy them.
When it comes right down to it, I am a male feminist. I want to empower women. I want to build their confidence, and give “regular girls” hope that they don’t have to look like a supermodel to be desirable, capable, and powerful creatures. That is the essence of my nude work. That is the positive message I hope to share through the collection and publication of that work. Some people will have issues with my collection. I expect it to be far more controversial than my collection of nightlife dancer photos. I guess that’s the price you pay when artistic integrity means more to you than making the critics happy. I’m willing to pay it, because I’m passionate about my work, and I think the message I’m trying to convey is an important one with the potential to help a lot of people.
I really hope that my wife, and women like her will be able to see it for what it is, and feel uplifted by it. Maybe that’s silly. Maybe it will backfire. I can’t worry about that, though. I am driven to express myself creatively, because I am a creative person. That’s how I communicate. I hope that some people will get the message, but I’m not going to stop just because others don’t.
HAHAHAHAHA First and last: Mormonville where they view polygamy as morally acceptable? And this quote on quote “feminist” really think she has any room to label these girls as harlots? In my “personal” opinion, this so-called “feminist” lacks self-esteem and probably self criticizes herself on a daily basis, flipping through glamour magazines wishing she can be glammed up and pretty like the girls on print, but has no self-confidence whatsoever to pursue modeling. This condecending “feminist” is nothing more than a jealous-raged unfit/unhealthy female that couldn’t get any attention except to talk blasphemy towards Erick or the female models he’s worked with. Also, if you have not personally worked with Erick or any photographer, you have no right to post controversial comments except keep them to yourself. And finally, if girls want to portray themselves in the nude, by all means that is their will. It is THEIR portfolio, it is THEIR body. My gosh, this stupid woman is acting like we’re committing abortion here. This is a free country right? Do what the eff we want country right? But if you’re going to try and offend someone’s work because you are not a part of it, shut your mouth. It’s like those people who judge an ethnic food based on looks but have never tasted it, or a book by its cover, etc. I can go on and on, but the cool thing is, Erick is so cool that he’s not going to let this b.s. get to him. Keep on truckin’ Erick Hamilton! It was a pleasure to work with you, and NO I have not done nude shoots with him. This is simply my models point of view.
JAY MEDINA
i find this whole blog revolting hear are grown adults attacking others religion, lifestyles, jobs, and morals.
i know what one girl had to give up to become a dancer in fact one of these dancers i dont thinkk its for the best in fact i think its quite sad but at least im not attacking her mother for her mistakes. or her morals i know what she had to give up because i was the one filling in for her. you people must have no life because you think that your opinion matters in a world that the only one that matters is the one who pays you. some of you tell this man that his work is art like everyone thinks that but not everyone dose! shocker i know i personaly think its trash,
you told a Mother it was her fault that her daughter was a dancer, did she force at gun point her daughter to be a dancer? i doubt it it was the dancers choice, she will get a concequence. yes it would be terribly embarrassing for your daughter to dress in next to nothing but she is her own self the only thing you can do is love her and hope she gets a brain, and unfortunatly they dont fully develope untill 24.
im sure others have oppinions and my point wont make a differnce but, i had to point out who are you to tell someone that there religion is wrong or there a slut or whos fault it is. all of you people need to grow up!
re: “this is discusting”
I’m a bit puzzled by the personal attacks, myself.
I’m curious. Do you think all of my photography is trash, or just the shots of the half naked girls?